Sorry that I ask so many questions but I want to know.I have some more for anyone willing to try to help me find answers.

1)Once a persons soul is cast into hell do they still have the choice to repent?
2)If so where do they get the power to desire to repent from if they are in hell?
3)If demons can never feel God’s grace(how is it fair),isn’t it up to God to make them want to follow him?
4)How come it says in the bible that God will make Satan and his followers burn in hell for all eternity?
He speaks so much about forgiveness and mercy but rather than destroying him he chooses to make Satan burn in hell for all eternity.
5)Why not just destroy him?
6)How long should he suffer for all the evil he has done and all the people he has lead astray from God?
7)To become a “man” of God do you need to expierience one great moment of greatness?Could it be gradual?
I have read verses in the bible that say once you are with God you can never sin again.Yet Satan defies that.
So my question is…
8)Why does it say in the bible that once a person is with God they can never sin again if…Satan was an angel(which I believe is as close to God as you can get) was able to fall and commit the ultimate sin of leading people away from God?
9)Can peoples ancestors leave scars on their children because of their mistakes?

Here is my example
My grandmother was(not sure if she still is) very close to God.She spoke tounges,went to church,prayed and loved God.She lived in the ghetto,was poor,had to become mature very fast.She married very young to a man who had a drinking problem(my grandfather).She conceived four children before she had a divorce because my grandfather was abusive when he was drunk and he refused to change his ways.I believe after the divorce she became a lesbian and began to commit homosexuality.She told me that one day she was looking at a woman and she realized she loved another woman.I am her grandson and I have to fight my sinful nature and lust for other men(I myself am a young man)every single day.She has not changed her ways and supports homosexuality.

10)So my question is could my grandmother have put this burden on my back when she chose to give into homosexuality?
If this is the case…
11)When I am relieved of my sinful nature and no longer have any lust for other men will any of the generations after me have to deal with this curse(if a curse is what it is)?
12)How is it fair to leave this kind of burden on someone who never had a choice?
13)How much longer do I need to live in pain and suffering?How many tears do I need to cry?How many more years will I be tortured?How much longer before I do not need to fear seeing another man?How much longer before my thoughts are my own?How many times do I want to die before I want to live?How many more people will be encouraged through me before He frees me?How many times do I need to ask Him to save me before He saves me?
.

What do YOU think?

comments

Comments

  1. I see this is an old post, but I will comment anyway just in case there is someone out there that has the same problem as the man who posted “Sorry I asked so many questions…”

    Choice is an attribute of God. God is a God of choice, so every spiritual being and every physical being He has created has a choice also. Satan chose to go the way he went.

    Our will is a precious commodity. God wants beings that choose to love and follow Him. He did not want beings that were programmed to love and follow Him. He wanted that being to love and follow Him willingly. If somebody loves you, wouldn’t you want that person to love you out of their own free will?—not because they were made to love you. The Bible says that God’s thoughts and ways are higher than ours. Only the Spirit of God can tell us what God’s thoughts and ways are. He knows the mind of the Father.

    You have a choice right now as to what path you will take. Don’t let yourself or anything else tell you that you can’t get out of this. If you don’t like the path you are going down, you don’t have to keep going down it. I’m sorry you are suffering so. It must be terrible to be a man and know that one is attracted to men instead of women. I see you are not too happy about it. Be glad you are not happy about it. That shows that you want something different. The fact that you have come to this site, shows that you want something different.

    You have asked a lot of deep questions. I see you are trying to figure things out. God is the only One that can make sense out of life. Without Him nothing makes sense. Whatever you need Him to be in your life, He will be. Do you need a Daddy? He will be your Dad. Do you need a friend? He will be your Friend. Don’t give up on yourself. You have what it takes to change. The question is: How bad do you want to change?

    There are two ways God moves the “mountains” in our lives: He either instantly removes that mountain, or He helps us over the mountain. If God instantly removes your desire for homosexuality that is a miracle. If He helps you gradually, then, there is something He wants you to learn along the way. You will learn something about Him and you willl learn something about yourself. But however God wants to do it, is up to Him. Just don’t give up on Him and don’t give up on yourself.

    • lookinforacity says:

      Sunrise

      I agree with the greater majority of the things you have commented on, and I like the way you express those beliefs. (I say the greater majority), because I haven’t heard all of your thoughts / beliefs as of yet.
      I would enjoy to hear what your thoughts are on the subject of Free Will, because it is not mentioned anywhere in the entire Bible, yet you seem to think we have a free will. I am of the opinion, we have to possess more than an assumption based upon logic, in order to form a solid foundation for the beliefs we profess.

      My opinion is, we naturally assume we have a Free Will, because we (mankind) were created in the image of God, but because of the fall, we also went through a dramatic transformation which was caused by that fall, therefore mankind is, no longer like God.

      Psa 14:2,3
      2) The LORD looked down from heaven upon the children of men, to see if there were any that did understand, and seek God.
      3) They are all gone aside, they are all together become filthy: there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

      Rom 3:10-12
      10) As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one:
      11) There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.
      12) They are all gone out of the way, they are together become unprofitable; there is none that doeth good, no, not one.

      If by logic of having a free will really does exist, then we should also possess the capability to come to God, at any time in our lives before we finally do.
      Free will should at some time supercede Grace, but it doesn’t, hasn’t, ever.
      In the light of these scriptures, I don’t see it, where within these verses is Free Will?

      Joh. 6:44
      No man can come to me, except the Father which hath sent me draw him: and I will raise him up at the last day.

      Joh. 6:65
      And he said, Therefore said I unto you, that no man can come unto me, except it were given unto him of my Father.

      Eph 2:8-10
      8.) For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
      9) Not of works, lest any man should boast.
      10) For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus unto good works, which God hath before ordained that we should walk in them.

      Free will can’t be in the acceptance of Gods’ Grace, because it says, “we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus.”

      Gods Grace is not just in the offering of the gift, but in the performing of that gift for us, because we cannot do it on our own, He draws us to Himself, and then gives us the Faith to believe, that we may be partakers of the Heavenly Gift.

      When you say:
      “Our will is a precious commodity. God wants beings that choose to love and follow Him. He did not want beings that were programmed to love and follow Him. He wanted that being to love and follow Him willingly.”

      “If somebody loves you, wouldn’t you want that person to love you out of their own free will?—not because they were made to love you.

      Logically Yes, but this is what scripture has to say about out Love towards the Father.

      1Jn. 4:10
      Herein is love, not that we loved God, but that he loved us, and sent his Son to be the propitiation for our sins.

      1Jn. 4:19
      We love him, because he first loved us.

      So it appears as though His ways are not our ways, and His thoughts are higher than our thoughts.

      Paul could be used as a type of every man, he is the perfect example of how we do not come to God on our own, out of a free will, because up until the moment Paul was knocked off that horse, he was diametrically opposed to God and His purposes. But only through the Grace of God, Jesus was revealed to him.
      Isn’t Paul’s conversion on the road to Damascus an Archetype of our own Conversion?
      God reaches down to us, pulling us out of our life of sin, before we ask.

      Gal 1:13-16
      13) For ye have heard of my conversation in time past in the Jews’ religion, how that beyond measure I persecuted the church of God, and wasted it:
      14) And profited in the Jews’ religion above many my equals in mine own nation, being more exceedingly zealous of the traditions of my fathers.
      15) But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother’s womb, and called me by his grace,
      16) To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:

      The questions are:
      1) What do we actually lose, if we do not actually possess a Free Will?
      2) How does it change us, or anything we have become in Christ?
      3) Does not having a Free Will diminish us, or our walk with the Lord?
      4) What dose it profit us to have a Free Will?

      Rom 6:16
      Know ye not, that to whom ye yield yourselves servants to obey, (HIS SERVANTS YE ARE) to whom ye obey; whether of sin unto death, or of obedience unto righteousness?

      Rom 6:20
      For when ye were the (SERVANTS OF SIN), ye were free from righteousness.

      Rom 6:22,23
      22) But now being made free from sin, and become (SERVANTS OF GOD), ye have your fruit unto holiness, and the end everlasting life.
      23) For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

      The word Servant in the Greek is rendered (SLAVE) a slave does not possess a Free Will to self determination.
      Our old man was a slave to sin, a subject to Unrighteousness.
      The New Creature, is a slave of God, unto Righteousness and true Holiness.

      Be Blessed
      JIM

      • I’m not sure what you are getting at, but obviously you have put a lot of thought into it. Anyway, thank you for your input.

      • This is some information that I found on the will and free will.

        WILL [verb]: 6a—used to express determination, insistence, persistence, or willfulness. Example: I have made up my mind to go and I will.

        WILL [noun]—1: DESIRE, WISH: a: DISPOSITION, INCLINATION b: APPETITE, PASSION c. a choice or determination of one having authority or power

        Referenced from: Webster’s Seventh New Collegiate Dictionary, pg. 1021, Copyright 1963

        FREE WILL [noun]: 1: the power asserted of moral beings of choosing limitations or with respect to some matters without restraint of physical or divine necessity or causal law 2: the ability to choose between alternatives so that the choice and action are to an extent creatively determined by the conscious subject

        Referenced from: Webster’s Seventh New Collegiate Dictionary, pg. 333, Copyright 1963

        WILL [noun]: determination, resolve, willpower, motivation, drive, backbone, spirit, self-control, force, strength of character, guts, desire, wish, inclination, longing, ambition, choice, preference, bidding, command, dictate

        Will [verb]: want, wish, desire, pray, yearn, long, yearn for, long for, hope against hope

        Referenced from: Microsoft Word Thesaurus

      • new creature says:

        Jim if I may make a comment re man is no longer like God, owing to his fall into sin and death.
        Though man is no longer as he was when made perfect, there is still a remnant of God’s image and likeness in Adam’s children, and his capacities and functions still operate but are self oriented.
        And now with respect to returning to his former estate neither man cannot. But through Jesus Christ he can transcend that former state. It is a strange blessing that man fell, for that which comes through Jesus, neither Adam nor we could have had, had he not fell.

      • new creature says:

        Glad to see you making mention of the word slave in relation to us, both pre Christ and post Christ (if I can put it like that).
        I am not sure if I have mentioned it before, but it worth saying again.
        This can be used past tense and present tense for both states – with or without Christ. But I will just use it in connection to our new state in Christ.

        Slaves are bought for a price. We were bought with the precious blood of Jesus – we are not our own (1 Cor. 6:20; 1 Pe. 1:19).
        Servants are hired for reward. We are hired by Jesus to work in His vineyard (Matt. 20:1-16; Jn 4:36)
        The Greek allows for both slaves and servants according to Strong. But many don’t like the idea of using the word slaves because they are thinking (unconsciously or deliberate) in terms of the slave trade through out the world’s history..
        We are also called children (fully provided for and nurtured), sons and daughters (joint heirs with Christ, saints (holy – pure ones), priests (bringing sacrifices to), of the Most High Living God.
        How magnificently generous is our God, because of Jesus Christ His most Beloved Son.

    • blueaquachairs says:

      after reading you’re post I’vebecomesomuch more encouraged to completemy tasks…no regrets

      • new creature says:

        God has complete and perfect free will.
        Observation tells us that man has a will, and the power to exercise it freely, but with considerable limitations, and only when certain factors are in place.

  2. May God’s will be done in your life my friend through these:

    1)Once a persons soul is cast into hell do they still have the choice to repent?

    – they may want to repent but they had their whole life on earth the chance to repent but they chose not to.

    2)If so where do they get the power to desire to repent from if they are in hell?
    -it’s not a power, it is caused by extreme pain and suffering
    3)If demons can never feel God’s grace(how is it fair),isn’t it up to God to make them want to follow him?

    – the difference between the fall of satan with his demons (former angels) and man is that, nobody tempted satan to commit sin but himself,, whereas, man sinned because someone else (satan) tempted him. That is the basis of how God treats man and demons.

    4)How come it says in the bible that God will make Satan and his followers burn in hell for all eternity?
    He speaks so much about forgiveness and mercy but rather than destroying him he chooses to make Satan burn in hell for all eternity.

    – That is true love. True love demands justice. We may not understand it now why it’s eternal. God will tell us why when we meet him. One thing this “eternal punishment has done to a wretched sinner that was me” is that it gave me real fear. You know what will happen if the punishment will just be banishment or instant death? I know, I will just enjoy the maximum lust of this flesh on earth without fear and take that one instant death joyfully at the end.

    5)Why not just destroy him?

    God in His wisdom can turn an evil thing that satan does into something good. Because of satan’s tempting of man, God can now use that to select men who deserve to enter heaven (does not mean salvation by works here).

    God demonstrated this when Satan tempted men to kill Jesus. This is the worst crime ever committed. The loving Creator killed by His evil creation called man. This worst crime God made into the BEST event that ever happened because of that event, man can be saved.

    I believe that all the evil things that satan has ever done into you life, God can make it into something good. How? You’ll see the answer gradually if you turn to God.

    6)How long should he suffer for all the evil he has done and all the people he has lead astray from God?
    -eternity

    7)To become a “man” of God do you need to experience one great moment of greatness? Could it be gradual?

    -to be a son of God, it takes a moment. That moment of greatness that you are talking about is HUMILITY.
    -to become a man of God (meaning a true servant of God) it requires that you pass His exams/trials

    I have read verses in the bible that say once you are with God you can never sin again.Yet Satan defies that.

    A verse says that “No one who abides in Him sins; no one who sins has seen Him or knows Him.” I believe that means if we sin willfully, it means we do not really abide in Him. Satan did not abide that time when he rebelled against God.

    So my question is…
    8)Why does it say in the bible that once a person is with God they can never sin again if…Satan was an angel(which I believe is as close to God as you can get) was able to fall and commit the ultimate sin of leading people away from God?

    – answered above

    9)Can peoples ancestors leave scars on their children because of their mistakes?
    Here is my example
    My grandmother was(not sure if she still is) very close to God.She spoke tounges,went to church,prayed and loved God.She lived in the ghetto,was poor,had to become mature very fast.She married very young to a man who had a drinking problem(my grandfather).She conceived four children before she had a divorce because my grandfather was abusive when he was drunk and he refused to change his ways.I believe after the divorce she became a lesbian and began to commit homosexuality.She told me that one day she was looking at a woman and she realized she loved another woman.I am her grandson and I have to fight my sinful nature and lust for other men(I myself am a young man)every single day.She has not changed her ways and supports homosexuality.

    When you are not yet born again, yes, you inherit the curse including Adam’s because you are just like a branch in the big family tree of Adam and Eve. When a man is born again, he (as a branch) is cut out and grafted to another family tree of Jesus Christ.That tree or body of Jesus has no curse at all but ALL spiritual blessings.

    10)So my question is could my grandmother have put this burden on my back when she chose to give into homosexuality?
    Your grandmother did not. You took it willfully.

    If this is the case…
    11)When I am relieved of my sinful nature and no longer have any lust for other men will any of the generations after me have to deal with this curse(if a curse is what it is)?

    That depends on your decision “NOW” before you even have your sons and daughters and while you are still alive.

    12)How is it fair to leave this kind of burden on someone who never had a choice?

    You will understand later.

    13)How much longer do I need to live in pain and suffering?How many tears do I need to cry?How many more years will I be tortured?How much longer before I do not need to fear seeing another man?How much longer before my thoughts are my own?How many times do I want to die before I want to live?How many more people will be encouraged through me before He frees me?How many times do I need to ask Him to save me before He saves me?

    He can save you NOW. You must know our God. God saved me and showed me true Christianity. I pray that you spend sometime listening to the audio that are found in the following link.

    http://www.cfcindia.com/web/mainpages/basic_christian_teachings.php

    Please do not underestimate this website because it is Indian. I am not Indian myself.

  3. Gay Lesbians (Perverts) their lot is hell and hell is no joke!. You can refere to this site :
    “http://spiritlessons.com/Mary_K_Baxter_A_Divine_Revelation_of_Hell.htm”.

    There is only one way in which you can go to heaven. Ask the Lord Jesus Christ to come into your life and be your personal saviour. You can be saved.

    There is no other way.

    About the Gay Gene.

    The bible states in Romans 1:25 “They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator–who is forever praised. Amen”

    26 “Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. ”

    27 “In the same way, the men turned away from their natural love 4 women.
    They burned with sexual longings 4 each other. Men did shameful things with
    other men. They suffered in their bodies 4 all the twisted things they did.

    This is where the Gay gene was developed.

    The only time you can repent is when you still have the breath of life in you.

    In hell you cannot repent.

    • sunnstorms says:

      Please use a Lexicon to know what the scriptures here said in the original language of Greek. Verse 25 is talking about odol worship. Verse 26 is talking about prostitutes, not lesbians. Verse 27 is talking about LUST, not love…there is a difference. Using old English/modern English translations without learning the original language as well (as is in a Lexicon) has caused SO much false understanding, pain, and unrighteous judgement against our brothers and sisters. Please don’t be a contributing factor. Calling someone a pervert causes pain…something Jesus would NEVER abide. Love never seeks to hurt.

      Oddly enough, this verse is the same in both the original language, and in modern English…
      Luke 17:34
      I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left.

      • Why should I believe that all the translators of the Bible got it wrong in Romans 1, and you and other advocates of homosexual behavior got it right?

        I looked at the Greek and you are just making all this stuff up. Where are these lexicons you are quoting? Send me an email.

        I am going to block you for a while on this site, because I consider that you are very active in promoting sexual immorality on this site by changing the meanings of words, and I did not create this site for that purpose. I also disagree with your ideas on hell.

        To me, you are very dangerously deceived and I won't let you use this site to do what I consider to be the work of deception.

        Until I have time to review and reply to all your arguments I won't be having you post on this site.

        I don't do this full time.

      • new creature says:

        Dear friend if you are still our there and have not repented, or any one who thinks like this fellow has spoken,
        Why do you twist the Scriptures? You do so to your own destruction. Jesus was not talking about homosexuals being in the same bed and one of them going to Heaven.
        In some prisoner of war camps, 2or 3 men were often forced to share the same bed. This was simply because of the lack of compassion and mercy on those who lorded it over them, while their taskmasters slept in quilted beds. Are we to assume that every one of those men so imprisoned were homosexuals? Perhaps your lustful dictates would wish it so.

        Repent of this your wickedness. Unless you repent you will perish and then you will find out about what you have done before God – but it will be too late. There is no pleasure, not even sinful pleasure in Hell.

        Haven’t you read about men who have had to shelter up close together in snow blizzards over night in order to share body heat just to stay alive? Two men in one bed…
        Don’t you know that in some impoverished countries, two men have to share one blanket in the night because they are so poor? Two men in one bed…

        Jesus would never condemn an honest seeker after truth no matter how wicked they may have been or still are. But Jesus hated hypocrisy and could see right through it. And he did lash out yet in love at hypocrites.
        Jesus called a spade a spade. He knew what was in man. And He knows what is in you. I tell you the truth Jesus loves your soul man. He wants you to come to Him in humility and brokenness or heart and contrite of spirit. He will wash you clean from all filthiness and make you fit for Heaven. If you will let Him.

        But if you will hang on to your sin and refuse to let it go God will give you what you want, and more than you could ever ask for. God is just and generous you know. If it is sin you want you will get its just rewards.
        But there is no need for you to go to Hell. Jesus went there for you. Hell is a horrible place. Every body who has gone there wants to get out but can’t.
        Heaven is a beautiful place. Every body who goes there wants to stay and and will.
        Hell is forever. So is Heaven.
        Jesus is the your only hope. Not the Jesus you have in your mind. The real Jesus who dies for sinners like you and me so that we may no longer serve sin but serve righteousness and please God. Repent my friend while you can. Tomorrow may be too late.

  4. beloved_daughter says:

    First of all Hopeful, you don’t have to apologise for seeking the truth, it sets everyone free. You have lived a hard life and the feelings within you are a real source of conflict, none of us can even pretend to understand what you might be going through with regards to your desires towards people of the same sex. By now you know that God is against this, he has been from the beginning that’s why the Israelites were commanded to put to death anyone caught in this web, Sodom and Gomorrah was destroyed for the very same reason, there are many accounts in the bible which tell us that this is a false desire of man fuelled by his rebellion towards God. Yet we cannot deny that despite what we see on TV – with the dismaying images of “gay pride” parades there are people (like yourself) burdened by the shame and curse of this abomination. All i can say is that do not be ashamed to not want this curse to be put on you, It is the spirit of God that is opposing this iniquity being wrought in you, He does not want you to give in, or buy into the lies and deception, that it is okay to be homosexual when we all know the truth inside us. God would not lie to us, God would not make mistakes and say He made woman for man and then turn around and ‘change his mind’, He is not a child, not even a human being, He is greater than what we can hope to imagine or even achieve. His grace is sufficient to see us through challenges like the one you facing until the truth can be revealed. Petition unto the Lord (our High Priest) who is seated on the right hand of our Father, make your pleas known and your objections heard in all of heaven that you do not want to partake in the works of our enemy, reject the lies no matter how hard, they will call you a fool, tell you this is who you really are, don’t buy into that, it’s all lies. The Lord will hear your petitions and intercede on your behalf. Trust in the one an only true God who works for the good of mankind not for their destruction.
    May the gracious Lord keep you in his grace and cover you with love and acceptance. In Jesus name, let it be done for you what you hope for.

    • sunnstorms says:

      I’m sorry, but you are wrong about why God destroyed these cities. EZ 16:
      49 Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, fulness of bread, and abundance of idleness was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy.
      50 And they were haughty, and committed abomination before me: therefore I took them away as I saw good.

      Homosexuality is not mentioned. The word “abomination” in v.50 means “idol worhip”. God always got angry when people turned away from Him, or hurt others. It wasn’t the act of homosexuality the men wanted to perpetrate on the angels in Lots house, it was the act of rape. Hurting someone else. All God has EVER asked from us is to love…love Him, and love one another. Rules, Laws, and guidelines were put forth to teach us how to love, but men turned them into burdensome “do’s” and “don’t’s”. Acts of kindness, charity, and forgiveness are the good fruits, and should come from a heart of love, rather than from a sense of obligation.

      The gay “shame” comes from the attitudes of family, friends, churches, and society, not God. If left alone, they would feel no shame for loving anyone…even someone of their own gender. Please read Romans very carefully. We are not to judge anyone in anything that they do in faith.

      That being said, you have a WONDERFUL heart for God 🙂 Your post is full of love, rather than condemnation and rejection. May God reward you richly.

      • Timothy Luke says:

        Gen 19:1-8 "And there came two angels to Sodom at even; and Lot sat in the gate of Sodom: and Lot seeing them rose up to meet them; and he bowed himself with his face toward the ground; And he said, Behold now, my lords, turn in, I pray you, into your servant's house, and tarry all night, and wash your feet, and ye shall rise up early, and go on your ways. And they said, Nay; but we will abide in the street all night.
        And he pressed upon them greatly; and they turned in unto him, and entered into his house; and he made them a feast, and did bake unleavened bread, and they did eat.
        But before they lay down, the men of the city, even the men of Sodom, compassed the house round, both old and young, all the people from every quarter: And they called unto Lot, and said unto him, Where are the men which came in to thee this night? bring them out unto us, that we may know them.
        And Lot went out at the door unto them, and shut the door after him, And said, I pray you, brethren, do not so wickedly.
        Behold now, I have two daughters which have not known man; let me, I pray you, bring them out unto you, and do ye to them as is good in your eyes: only unto these men do nothing; for therefore came they under the shadow of my roof."

        There is little room in the context here to suggest anything other than a sexual assault on these angels who came as men. Such an assault would of course be wickedness whether or not it was same sex or not.

        Jude 1:7 indicates this was an act of fornication…

        "Even as Sodom and Gomorrha, and the cities about them in like manner, giving themselves over to fornication, and going after strange flesh, are set forth for an example, suffering the vengeance." Fornication with the same sex is of course, homosexuality.

        For some reason, your eyes are closed to the reality of scripture. Romans is quite obvious in its meaning. If one seeks to diminish that or rewrite it, they can do so, but the clear and plain statement is that it is wrong for men to burn in lust with men. The plain fact of homosexuality is that it is a lust driven life and that LUST, not societal opinion, is the greatest stressor. These people keep hidden many times and avoid the societal opinion, so what is the stress coming from if everyone thinks they are normal anyway? I suspect the stress is from the unclean spirit driving them and making everyone else evil for not calling evil good. "woe unto those who call good evil and evil good…"

        God made sex for marriage. Homosexuality has never allowed for that, and it is not society's fault. Let the church also focus on the sins of divorce and remarriage and affairs with the same passion and we may actually clean up our own house. We should see these things all as sin and not make excuses for unnatural lusts that have no fulfillment in God's Word and purpose for man. To the degree I love the cancer victim, is the degree I will naturally hate the cancer that is hurting them. Homosexuality is the causal factor for the pain and confusion, etc., not the fact that others see it as problematic to Godly living.

        • sunnstorms says:

          True…fornication, whether by homosexuals or heterosexuals, is sin. But, fornication means “indiscriminate sex”, not two in a loving, committed, adult relationship. “and going after strange flesh” was going after those from other areas…those who worshipped idols. It doesn’t mean homosexuality.

          Romans is “obvious” if all you want to understand is the meanings attributed to it in the translated versions of scriptures. I prefer to see how God inspired them to be.
          “Lust”….that is looking at someone with the desire or intent to have sex with them…a selfish, temporary pleasure. “Love”, on the other hand, is to look at someone with the intention to have a life with them.

          “Homosexuality is the causal factor for the pain and confusion, etc., not the fact that others see it as problematic to Godly living.”

          Not true. It’s just opposite of what you say. Think about it…if gays weren’t rejected, ostracized, beaten, murdered, humiliated, taunted,…then what pain would there be that heteros don’t face?

          I want to tell you about a friend of mine. He had no problem talking to me about his partner, and their life together (not their sex life…I don’t listen to that from heteros, either). He would describe the same outings to the park, lake, mall, movies, dinner, etc that any straight couple would have. He talked about house hunting, and what they were looking for in a home. He talked about how they rescued a dog. Things his partner said or did to make him laugh or get angry. The same, normal things hetero couples do. He never, ever said he felt convicted, guilty, or bad about being gay. It’s as natural for him to love his partner as it is for me to love my hubby of 18 years.One night, the subject of religion came up, and he talked about the Lord and things God had done in his life. I asked where he went to church, and he said “I don’t go anymore”. I asked why not, and he told me that when the people of the church he attended for over 2 years found out he was gay, they asked him not to come back. He was HURT! He had been rejected by the very ones he had come to know and love. I asked if he was going to find another church, and he said no…he was afraid of being hurt and rejected again. He still loves the Lord, and tries to live his life full of love for others, but won’t risk the “religious royalty” again.

          Now, up till the subject of the church came up, he didn’t exhibit any pain. It’s only when he talked about being rejected by people that it entered in. So…this proves my point…it’s peoples rejection that causes pain, not homosexuality.

          Please read Romans 14 and tell me what you get out of it. I’d be interested to know.

          • Timothy Luke says:

            And what level of commitment does God require? That they keep each other for one another, before and during marriage, til death parts them. How many homosexuals do you know who did not "explore" their sexuality, or "experiment" with it outside of marriage?

          • sunnstorms says:

            Is this a trick question? Since gay marriage is not allowed in most states, the VAST majority of gays are having sex outside of marriage. So that was an unfair question.
            But, I will answer, and this requires a two part answer.
            First, if gays were allowed to marry, they would be less likely to bed-hop, since they know they can make a legal, binding “contract” of commitment.

            Second…homosexuals have the same level of commitment as heterosexuals have. Marriage doesn’t guarantee monogamy in anyone, straight or gay. Nor does heterosexuality guarantee that none will experiment with, or engage in sex before, or during, marriage.

            God asks 100% commitment from everyone in everything they do.
            Love others as if you are loving God.
            Work for your employer as if you are working for God.
            Help others as if you are helping God.

            Please answer to the question of concubines. Sex outside of singular marriage, and yet it was not condemned. Why is that?

          • warrior daughter says:

            Concubines come about due to man & not what God would want.

            Matthew 19:5,6 “For this reason a man shall leave his father & his mother & be joined to his wife & the two shall become one flesh….So they are no longer two but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let no man seperate.

            This does not say mutiple wives or concubines & this is God’s sacred way for marriage..To have mutiple wives/concubines is incompatible with being a Christian.

            Concubines came out of the wants of man just as divorce came about by man wanting divorce. Concubines were a wife but not a legal wife just as in today’s world where people live together but are not married. Some states recognize common law marriages & they have to obtain a legal divorce & in Bible times the man could divorce his concubine.

            If you read Scripture you will see time after time that concubines were a source of trouble to the husband & also to the legal wife.

          • sunnstorms says:

            Since you posted it, please explain …
            Matthew 19:5,6 ‘For this reason a man shall leave his father & his mother & be joined to his wife & the two shall become one flesh’….So they are no longer two but one flesh.”

            Hubby and I have been married for almost 19 years, and as much as we love each other and are committed to each other, we still are in TWO bodies, not “one flesh”. For that matter, I have never seen any two people in “one flesh”, other than conjoined twins, but they are born that way. So, please…enlighten me…what does “the two shall become one flesh” mean? And please don’t say they are joined in the body of a child they produce. This says nothing about childbearing, but even if that were true, what about barren couples? So, please, explain what it means.

            This scripture is a spiritual teaching by Jesus. He wasn’t talking about flesh and blood men and women. That’s why the Pharisees couldn’t understand what He was talking about. They were asking about physical things (carnally minded), and Jesus was answering them in a spiritual way (as He always did). If you truly understood the meaning of what was joined in one flesh, you would understand why Paul said he would not suffer a woman to teach, and yet made it a point to greet a FEMALE apostle.

            God never condemned concubines, and He blessed the offspring of Hagar….a concubine.

            “To have mutiple wives/concubines is incompatible with being a Christian.”

            Says who? In the NT, only BISHOPS were commanded to be the “husband of one wife”….leaving all others free to marry more than one. Otherwise, why not say “ALL men must be the husband of only one wife.”? One man/one woman marriage is a man-made tradition handed down from generation to generation until no one even notices that not ALL men are commanded to be the husband of one wife. Do you know what that fosters? Jealousy and coveting.

            1 Cor 13:4 Charity (Love) suffereth long, and is kind; charity envieth not; charity vaunteth not itself, is not puffed up

            The word “envieth” is
            ζηλοι verb – present active indicative – third person singular
            zeloo dzay-lo’-o: to have warmth of feeling for or against — affect, covet (earnestly), (have) desire, (move with) envy, be jealous over, (be) zealous(-ly affect).

            When people are limited to one, they become jealous. They begin to put their own happiness, wants, and needs above those of another. What do you think Sarah would have done if Abraham had taken Hagar without her blessing? Or any of the other “first wives”. They knew that love is not jealous, and that their husbands were capable of loving and providing for more than just them.

            “Concubines came out of the wants of man”
            Not true. Multiple marriages came about for a variety of reasons. To provide for the family of a dead brother, to have children when the wife was barren,….

            Concubines were not wives. They held a lower position in both the family and in society than wives were. Mistresses today are what concubines were then, only we consider them to be adultresses now. There is a difference between an adultress and a concubine. Concubines were not stoned to death, but adultresses were. Can you tell me the difference?

            And BTW…ONE wife can be a source of trouble to a man! LOL

          • lookinforacity says:

            The bible says homosexuality is sin.
            If you go about telling others, the Holy Spirit has shown you it is not, then you have become a false teacher.

            It all comes to the point, that homosexuals need to acknowledge their lifestyle is sin.
            Once they acknowledge their sin, then they can repent of that sin.

            By repenting, I don’t mean someone saying “I’m sorry for my sin”, because repenting isn’t something you say or feel, it is something you do, (stopping the sin) an actual turning away from the sin.

            Anyone having sin in their lives, no matter what kind of sin it might be, can never come to the point of repentance, if they do not acknowledge their sin, as sin.
            As long as the unrepentant sinner continues in the sin, they “ARE” separated from God.

            If a homosexual cannot have a relationship with another man, without having sex, then that relationship is based upon “LUST”, not “LOVE”.

            LUST – – G3715
            ὄρεξις
            orexis
            or’-ex-is
            From G3713; excitement of the mind, that is, longing after: – lust.

            G3713
            ὀρέγομαι
            oregomai
            or-eg’-om-ahee
            to stretch oneself, that is, reach out after (long for): – covet after, desire.

            The act of sex was ordained by God between a man and woman, He created both different, both possessing half of what is needed for the purpose of procreation.
            Anything occurring outside of that “NORM” ordained by God, is a perversion of that norm.

            You have acknowledged, sex by either homosexual, or heterosexual outside of marriage is sin, sex by a homosexual even if they were allowed by law to be married, would still constitute sin, on the grounds the state cannot determine what is moral or sin, that is a privilege which is reserved only for God, because all sin is against what God has said is sin.

            JIM

          • Timothy Luke says:

            Amen Jim!

          • Timothy Luke says:

            Mine is not a trick question. You are making assertions of what theoretically might be IF everyone condoned homosexuality and said it was normal and God given, as though there is no real world, concrete way to ascertain the behaviors of homosexuals based on the liberties they currently have. Look at the hard stats on how many different sex encounters and/or partners the average homosexual has and you will see the lie in what you are stating. They are more prone to multiple 'lovers' in any given month than heterosexuals by far.

            In September of 2006, the Agape Press reported the following:

            A survey by The Advocate, a homosexual magazine, revealed that promiscuity is a reality among homosexuals. The poll found that 20 percent of homosexuals said they had had 51-300 different sex partners in their lifetime, with an additional 8 percent having had more than 300.

            This is not a lifestyle, it is a deathstyle and you embrace its ideological falicies as one who engages in the practice, or has had to justify the thought of losing a loved one for eternity who so engages. If you do so engage in it, you are commanded by the Lord to repent and be renewed. You answer to HIM, not me… so, I will not ask you to repent nor demand anything of you… but please, do not expect people to buy your faulty logic and misinterpretation of scripture.

            Again, it is a lie to assert as plausible conjecture that were marriage available to homosexuals, they would live chaste lives within marriage bounds as well as heterosexuals do.

            In 2003, LifeSite reported the following regarding a Amsterdam study:

            As Canada and several U.S. states move toward the legalization of so-called homosexual "marriage," a new study has found that homosexual partnerships last, on average, only one-and-a-half years.

            The study is based on the health records of young Dutch homosexuals by Dr. Maria Xiridou of the Amsterdam Municipal Health Service and published in the May issue of the journal AIDS. It also found that men in homosexual relationships have an average of eight partners a year outside their main partnership, adding more evidence to the "stereotype" that homosexuals tend to be promiscuous.[9][10]

             

            1Co 6:9-20 "Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,  Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God.

            And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God.
            All things are lawful unto me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but I will not be brought under the power of any.
            Meats for the belly, and the belly for meats: but God shall destroy both it and them. Now the body is not for fornication, but for the Lord; and the Lord for the body.
            And God hath both raised up the Lord, and will also raise up us by his own power.
            Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ? shall I then take the members of Christ, and make them the members of an harlot? God forbid.
            What? know ye not that he which is joined to an harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh.
            But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit.
            Flee fornication. Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body.
            What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own?
            1Co 6:20  For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's."

            As for "trick question," there is a reason there has not been homosexual marriage as a historical right. From the beginning these things were not so.

            A trick statement about gay genes and people found with this and that hormone or chemical whatever is stated by you as proof that God made man in a state of gender flux and so homosexuality is part of God's created order. This is not so. The earth was corrupted when sin entered in. Your stats are not a reflection of God's original and pure creation that He calls us to follow, as much as they are evidence of the fall of man into sin and the depravity, pain and chaos of hell that now holds this world captive until the revelation of the sons of God.

            Sunnstorms, there is more storm than sun in what you are writing. If the Bible and God and nature were your true guide, you would not be so misguided in your interpretation and seeking to overthrow every word that clearly speaks against the point you wish so dearly to make.
            http://www.conservapedia.com/Homosexuality_Statistics gives the following information that addresses some of the mythological points you have affirmed. May the Lord grant us all His heart and mind on this topic and grant us repentance to the acknowledging of the truth that we might escape from the snare of the devil.

          • Timothy Luke says:

            Mat 19:4-9  "And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,
            And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?
             Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.
            They say unto him, Why did Moses then command to give a writing of divorcement, and to put her away?
            He saith unto them, Moses because of the hardness of your hearts suffered you to put away your wives: but from the beginning it was not so.
            And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery.
            "

            Your answer is found in this exchange. From the beginning, God created marriage in purity. Here is what it looked like…

            Gen 2:18-24  And the LORD God said, It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him an help meet for him.
            Gen 2:19  And out of the ground the LORD God formed every beast of the field, and every fowl of the air; and brought them unto Adam to see what he would call them: and whatsoever Adam called every living creature, that was the name thereof.
            Gen 2:20  And Adam gave names to all cattle, and to the fowl of the air, and to every beast of the field; but for Adam there was not found an help meet for him.
            Gen 2:21  And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;
            Gen 2:22  And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.
            Gen 2:23  And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.
            Gen 2:24  Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.
            "

            What we clearly see is that "for this cause" referred directly to the woman, who came out of the man. Adam did not have a helper suitable (meet)for him, so God made Eve to be that life partner. He did not create another man. The creation of the woman was not enough to ensure Godly generations. God therefore commanded marriage and fidelity to one spouse only. This one spouse was to be of the opposing gender, who was made specifically for this purpose.

            Jesus tells his disciples that God's original intent is what was still expected, even though standards were lowered due to the 'hardness of their hearts." There is no place of concubines in the Christian Church today… so why do we make an issue of it to make allowance for homosexuality? Your arguments are grasping at straws, trying to come up with something that sticks, but in reality lacks integrity.

          • new creature says:

            God is love. God is holy – pure and undefiled, and has no darkness in Him.
            Love is patient, is kind, is not anxious, is not vain or empty, is not puffed up, does not behave itself unseemly or indecently, does not pursue its own things,is not easily provoked, and thinks no evil. Love does not rejoice in unrighteousness (including making excuses for your sin), but rejoices in the truth; quietly overs all things, believes all things and hopes all for things (good) and endures all things. (See 1 Corinthians 13)

            Jesus Christ the Son of God and Son of Man fulfilled all these things perfectly. Jesus is the Truth. Do you rejoice in Jesus Christ? To rejoice in Jesus Christ is to love.
            God commands faithfulness. He says that everything we do we must do for His glory not for our own. Homosexuals have a commitment but not according to God’s own holy standards. God doesn’t ask anything from us but what He asked from His own Beloved Son Jesus Christ.

            Being committed in marriage will only truly be realized if in the first place each – husband and wife are both fully submitted to Jesus Christ. In such a relationship each is not dependent on the other firstly but on Jesus Christ who is the source of all things. And out of that relationship with Jesus Christ, faithfulness to each other will be the fruit.

            Concubines were ‘allowed’ by God in the old testament, because Jesus Christ had not yet come to reveal the Father and the coming judgment.
            Many other things were ‘allowed’ in those days before Jesus Christ.
            But now Christ HAS come. And God commands everyone everywhere to repent for He is going to judge every one on the day appointed by His Son Jesus Christ and He evidenced this by raising Jesus from the dead. (Acts 17:30-31)
            Now my friend not only here but elsewhere you have been warned as all of us have. Flee from the wrath to come and repent, calling upon the name of Jesus who is able to open your blind eyes so that you may see Him in all His power and purity and love for you. He showed His love for you by dying in your place even though you hated Him. Let not His love pass you by my neighbour.
            Run to Him while you can and stop fighting Him. You will never win a fight with Jesus. He is your King. He is your Lord. He is your God. It is prudent to humble yourself before Him and cry Have mercy on me a sinner – as we all have had to do. Your sin is not greater than ours. But your sin will consign you to Hell unless you fess up and let Jesus wash it all away with His precious blood that He shed for you. It is up to you.

      • lookinforacity says:

        As you can see God ordained from creation, man and woman to be joined together.
        The following verses from Mt. are only a quote which comes from Gen. both showing what God has ordained.

        Mt. 19:4-6
        4) And he answered and said unto them, Have ye not read, that he which made them at the beginning made them male and female,
        5) And said, For this cause shall a man leave father and mother, and shall cleave to his wife: and they twain shall be one flesh?
        6) Wherefore they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder.

        Gen 2:21-24
        21) And the LORD God caused a deep sleep to fall upon Adam, and he slept: and he took one of his ribs, and closed up the flesh instead thereof;
        22) And the rib, which the LORD God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man.
        23) And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man.
        24) Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh.

        The first mention of homosexuality comes from Lev. then from the New Testament in Rom. both places condemn homosexuality, lesbianism, bestiality.
        Lev 18:22-30
        22) Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.
        23) Neither shalt thou lie with any beast to defile thyself therewith: neither shall any woman stand before a beast to lie down thereto: it is confusion.
        24) Defile not ye yourselves in any of these things: for in all these the nations are defiled which I cast out before you:
        25) And the land is defiled: therefore I do visit the iniquity thereof upon it, and the land itself vomiteth out her inhabitants.
        26) Ye shall therefore keep my statutes and my judgments, and shall not commit any of these abominations; neither any of your own nation, nor any stranger that sojourneth among you:
        27) (For all these abominations have the men of the land done, which were before you, and the land is defiled;)
        28) That the land spue not you out also, when ye defile it, as it spued out the nations that were before you.
        29) For whosoever shall commit any of these abominations, even the souls that commit them shall be cut off from among their people.
        30) Therefore shall ye keep mine ordinance, that ye commit not any one of these abominable customs, which were committed before you, and that ye defile not yourselves therein: I am the LORD your God.

        I want you to be fully informed as to what you are attempting to legitimize.
        This is what God said about homosexuality.
        (abomination, defile, confusion, vomiteth, land is defiled, abominable customs,
        That the land spue not you out also, when ye defile it, as it spued out the nations that were before you.

        Rom 1:26,27
        26) For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the (NATURAL USE) into that which is (AGAINST NATURE):
        27) And likewise also the (MEN), leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their (LUST) one toward another; (MEN WITH MEN) working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.

        When the bible says
        Gen 18:20
        And the LORD said, Because (THE CRY OF SODOM AND GOMORRAH IS GREAT), and because their sin is very grievous;

        That was the CRY OF THE LAND which was heard by God.
        We face the same danger today with the proliferation of homosexuality, of being spued out of our land by the land itself, because of the sin of homosexuality committed in it.

        JIM

  5. sunnstorms says:

    LOL whoa up there buddy! I’m going to try to answer your questions, but since you have so many all at once, it might be a bit difficult to answer them all at once 🙂
    1)Hell is not permanent for most humans. Only Satan and those who deliberately choose to serve him will suffer in the Lake of Fire for eternity. Rev. 21:8 says “But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.”
    Their part…not the whole eternity thing. Those who are not saved will go through a purification process. The dross will be burned away, and that which is pure is what will be left, and that is what will go on to Heaven. Many people live a good life, but never accept the gift of Christ (like Muslims, Hindus, agnostics,…). There is a place for them in Heaven, when all is said and done. There is only ONE Path, and that is through Jesus. Jesus was and is the epitomy of love. It’s only by love we can enter in, and those of other religions (or no religion) are capable of unselfish love. It’s not up to us to judge whom Jesus will allow in. We just need to love 🙂 “Every knee will bow, every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord”…Lord…Master…how can He be Master of someone if he/she isn’t with Him to serve Him?
    2)It’s not a time for repentance, it’s a time of purification.
    3)Demons have already made their choice to serve Satan and wreak havoc on humanity. God isn’t going to force Himself on them, any more than He forces Himself on us.
    4)5)6) lol Satan wants nothing more than to usurp God, and take His Throne. Satan has, since the beginning of time, done all he can to destroy what God has created, so it will be till the end of time that he pays for his deeds.
    7)To become a “man of God”, all one has to do is turn away from hate and selfishness, and learn to love as God has asked us to, and showed us in the example of His Son Jesus. When we can love like that, we can’t/won’t sin. One won’t steal from someone they love. They won’t do anything to hurt someone they love…and we are to love EVERYONE, even our enemies. When you can begin to do that, you are a man after Gods own heart 🙂
    8)Satan and the fallen angels fell to ego. They began to want to be superior to God, rather than love God. We cannot sin if we love as God asks. Is it possible to love someone absolutely, and yet rape them?
    9)10)11)12)Your grandmother didn’t put this “burden” on you. You are what God made you to be. The child of an alcoholic can very well decide never to drink, because they have choice about what is put into their bodies. God created 1 out of 100 bodies to carry both male and female chemistry/genitalia…that isn’t choice, it’s God-created biology.
    13)Only as long as you allow others to define who you are 🙂 God has already defined you. You are His creation, and as such, you are precious to Him. Precious enough that He gave His only begotten Son for you. Don’t allow anyone to tell you any different. Just because they listen to lies doesn’t mean you have to.

    Remember your questions about Satan and the punishment in store for him? This is why he will spend an eternity in the fire. He’ll have plenty of time to think about all he did to people like you from the beginning of time. Even the torture he puts you through using well-intentioned, but horrible misguided Christians. It isn’t just you. It isn’t just people today. It’s ALL the people who ever lived, all over the earth. That’s a lot of pain, and he has to suffer the consequences of his actions. God IS a jealous God…He doesn’t like anyone messing with His kids 🙂

    • warrior daughter says:

      This entire post is not scriptural even though there are scripture references.
      I am surprized that there are no references to other religions’ books.

      Stop trying to lead people away from the Truth to embrace your truth which is your own truth full of lies from the father of lies….

      “)It’s not a time for repentance, it’s a time of purification”

      Where in the Word of God does it state purification & not repentance???. One can not be pure without repentance. Our righteousness (morally good) is as filthy rags before God.

      • Sorry, you must have misunderstood…in HELL there is no repentace. The time for that is over by then.

        And it”s the fire which purifies.
        1 Corinthians 3:13
        Every man’s work shall be made manifest: for the day shall declare it, because it shall be revealed by fire; and the fire shall try every man’s work of what sort it is.
        1 Corinthians 3:15
        If any man’s work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved; yet so as by fire.

  6. sunnstorms says:

    “Gay gene”? You mean there’s a “straight gene”? Actually, science has shown that 1 out of 100 babies are born with varying degrees of both male and female hormones/chemistry and/or genitalia. These chemicals are contributing factors which cause people to be attracted to one gender or the other (or both). God creates all life, and God doesn’t make mistakes. Alcohol wasn’t introduced into the body by God, any more than drugs or the urge to kill is, so this argument is built on a false premise.

    As far as a “cure”, a huge majority of those “cured” are just bending to what family, friends, church, and society wants to hear and see. Most admit that they still “want”, but “won’t” because of pressure from those around them. That isn’t a cure, it’s living a lie.

    The American Academy of Pediatrics, stated: “Therapy directed specifically at changing sexual orientation is contraindicated, since it can provoke guilt and anxiety while having little or no potential for achieving changes in orientation.”

    The American Psychiatric Association released a Fact Sheet in 1994-SEP which stated:
    “There is no published scientific evidence supporting the efficacy of ‘reparative therapy’ as a treatment to change ones sexual orientation. It is not described in the scientific literature, nor is it mentioned in the APA’s latest comprehensive Task Force Report, ‘Treatments of Psychiatric Disorders (1989).
    There are a few reports in the literature of efforts to use psychotherapeutic and counseling techniques to treat persons troubled by their homosexuality who desire to become heterosexual; however, results have not been conclusive, nor have they been replicated. There is no evidence that any treatment can change a homosexual person’s deep seated sexual feelings for others of the same sex.'”.

    • The scientific literature can say what it wants to. Scientists can be swayed by societal agendas and the desire for funding.

      God's Word is Romans 1:18-32 says that people given over to unclean lusts, especially homosexual lusts, are under the Judgement of God.

      It also says that the people who approve such things are even worse than those who do them.

      Rom 1:24  Therefore God also gave them up to uncleanness, in the lusts of their hearts, to dishonor their bodies among themselves,
      Rom 1:25  who exchanged the truth of God for the lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen.
      Rom 1:26  For this reason God gave them up to vile passions. For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature.
      Rom 1:27  Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due.
      Rom 1:28  And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a debased mind, to do those things which are not fitting;
      Rom 1:29  being filled with all unrighteousness, sexual immorality, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, evil-mindedness; they are whisperers,
      Rom 1:30  backbiters, haters of God, violent, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
      Rom 1:31  undiscerning, untrustworthy, unloving, unforgiving, unmerciful;
      Rom 1:32  who, knowing the righteous judgment of God, that those who practice such things are deserving of death, not only do the same but also approve of those who practice them.

       

      Be very careful what you approve. The judgement of God is coming on western society shortly in a powerful way. But most people will be too blind to perceive what it is all about. It is about despising the Word of God, despising God's authority, despising God's holiness and living to please oneself.

      • sunnstorms says:

        When reading this chapter, consider who Paul was talking to, and about…idol worshippers…
        Verse 26 is referring to prostitutes, not lesbians (in the original Greek language).
        Verse 27 is talking about lust, not love…lust leading to fornication (which, in the original Greek means “indiscriminate sex”)

        It was common in those days for those who worshipped false gods to use male and female prostitutes as a form of worship (temple prostitutes).

        Rom 1:28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a debased mind, to do those things which are not fitting;
        Rom 1:29 being filled with all unrighteousness, sexual immorality, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, evil-mindedness; they are whisperers,
        Rom 1:30 backbiters, haters of God, violent, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
        Rom 1:31 undiscerning, untrustworthy, unloving, unforgiving, unmerciful;
        Rom 1:32 who, knowing the righteous judgment of God, that those who practice such things are deserving of death, not only do the same but also approve of those who practice them.

        This can apply to just about anyone…it isn’t the sole proprietorship of homosexuals, or even idol worshippers. I know many IN the churches I’ve attended who fit these descriptions. Just the other night, I watched a story on the nightly news about pastors and priests who don’t believe in God anymore, but since they aren’t trained for anything else, they remain behind the pulpit and “teach” about a God they don’t believe in.

        When I stand before my Lord Jesus to be judged, let Him find me guilty of loving, and accepting too much in the name of love, rather than for causing pain and judging unrighteously.

  7. Timothy Luke says:

    The Bible teaches it is appointed unto men once to die and after this the judgement. The judgement is always spoken of as the final act – indicating there is no option to repent after sentencing. “today is the day of salvation,” which is to say the time to choose is NOW. Later is not an option once the Lord returns. We have been warned.

    It is not up to God to make us want to follow Him. It is up to us to seek Him. “seek the Lord while He may be found” indicates there is a time when He cannot be found. God is going to have to move on with His eternal plans and when the train leaves, we need to be on it.

    The Bible has some interesting things to say about Satan’s fate. Why does it say them? – because they are statements of fact. What exactly do those statements mean is another question. God does not explain to us “why” He does what He does… He expects us to trust Him to have good reasons and we shall know those reasons in due season. He does not owe us an explanation for everything He does – He leaves us to trust until the day He reveals all things.

    How long should Satan and his demons suffer? God alone knows the suffering they have caused. He alone is the just Judge and His judgement is true. He knows how long, and we must trust Him and accept His judgement, rather than insist that He explain Himself to our limited minds.

    Not sure if question 7 is really being asked in question 8, but here goes…

    1Jn 3:9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.” Satan is not born of God. He is not created with God’s very spirit indwelling him. Mankind on the other hand is born from above. We have the spirit of God living in us and in that day we will be born fully of the spirit of God, whose seed remains in us. For this reason we will be set free from the power of sin once and for all – this is my best guess on the answer.

    9) Yes, absolutely. Sin is passed unto the 3rd and 4th generations. Parents with alcoholism tend to have children with the tendency. Angry parents often have angry children. The incidence rates go up dramatically when we see these things in our parents. Often there are also familiar spirits, or spirits that run in family lines that bring similar curses to us as well, stemming from the sins of the fathers.

    The devil put the temptation before your grandmother. She did not resist it. She gave place to it and a spirit of homosexuality entered the picture. It is not fair that you have this burden, but you DO HAVE a choice. You can be free of the burden. Advocates of the lifestyle would fight that truth. Here is a letter to the editor that was published just this Tuesday:

    “A good, short ‘letter to the editor’ in Missouri
    Share
    Tue at 6:21am
    NEWS-LEADER.COM
    SPRINGFIELD, MISSOURI

    December 29, 2009

    Gay gene represents rationalizing myth

    I don’t understand why some people buy into the “gay gene” myth. It seems to me that is as ludicrous as saying there is a “killing gene” we inherited from Cain and therefore we can rationalize killing other humans, especially those not yet born. How about an “alcoholic gene” or “smoking gene” therefore we have no control and are not responsible for our actions?

    Maybe the word “addiction” is more appropriate in those cases. Isn’t the best proof that there is no such gene the fact that homosexuals can be cured, changed if they want to be? Yes, a 90 percent cure rate has been repeatedly demonstrated by those groups who truly care about homosexuals. That’s considerably better than alcoholics or smokers. Such results would hardly be possible if there were a “homosexual gene” would they?

    It seems like people who promote the “gay gene” deception must hate homosexuals, who live a miserable life and die 33 years younger than normal heterosexuals. Now would they treat alcoholics or smokers the same way?

    Nichols, West Plains

    Link to article: http://www.news-leader.com/article/20091229/OPINIONS03/912290321/Gay+gene+represents+rationalizing+myth

    When you become free of it, your generations will be set free. They may or may not have the temptation but they will also have the power to resist and you will know how to help them stand in the victory you have won for them without them feeling alone in it like you now do… “Resist the devil and he will flee from you.”

    Life is not fair. That went out the window in Eden!

    How many tears, etc. Until you deal with it fully. There are ministries devoted to helping people with the problem you are facing overcome and be set free. There is deliverance to be had. Have you contacted someone like Exodus International? They help people come out of this lifestyle all the time.

    Be blessed my friend. You CAN be Free! and whom the Son sets free is free indeed!

    • sunnstorms says:

      You said “It seems like people who promote the “gay gene” deception must hate homosexuals, who live a miserable life and die 33 years younger than normal heterosexuals. Now would they treat alcoholics or smokers the same way?”

      Don’t you think the stress family, friends, employers, churches, and society puts on gays might have something to do with why the life expectancy for them is shorter?? Depression, suicide, ulcers, strokes, heart attacks,…..even cancers are brought on by, or exacerbated by, stress.

      Free indeed….free from judging others, free from jealousy, free from envy, free from strife, free from fear, free from materialism, ……free from anything that distracts us from serving God, and loving Him and others as we are told to. THAT is freedom!

      We are to correct our brothers when we see they are in sin….but sin is merely doing anything that will hurt God, ourselves, or others. Only when we see someone hurting another or themselves, are we to speak up.

      Lying for personal gain is wrong, because it hurts the one being lied to, and fosters selfishness in the liar. Rahab lied, and rather than paying for her “sin”, she was blessed because she did it in faith…out of love for her family.

      Envy is wrong because it causes the one envying to do what it takes to have what someone else has, and not to be content with what they already have.

      Jealousy is wrong, because it causes the jealous person anguish, and causes them to put their own wants above that of another.

      Homosexuality only causes pain when people condemn them for it.

      • Timothy Luke says:

        "Homosexuality only causes pain when people condemn them for it."

        So, the sexually transmitted diseases, including HIV among a host of others, are painless? Homosexuality doesn't cause pain when it brings upon a person massive confusion? They KNOW they are made specifically for the opposite sex – because that is the only way mankind can regenerate.

        I guess if I did not tell an alcoholic that drinking was bad for them, they would not have any pain either?

        Sin is what the Bible calls sin…

        Rom 1:22-32  "Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools, And changed the glory of the uncorruptible God into an image made like to corruptible man, and to birds, and fourfooted beasts, and creeping things.
        Wherefore God also gave them up to uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts, to dishonour their own bodies between themselves: Who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

        For this cause God gave them up unto vile affections: for even their women did change the natural use into that which is against nature: And likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust one toward another; men with men working that which is unseemly, and receiving in themselves that recompence of their error which was meet.


        And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not convenient; Being filled with all unrighteousness, fornication, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, debate, deceit, malignity; whisperers, Backbiters, haters of God, despiteful, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,  Without understanding, covenantbreakers, without natural affection, implacable, unmerciful: Who knowing the judgment of God, that they which commit such things are worthy of death, not only do the same, but have pleasure in them that do them."

        The bottom line in this discussion is, "is this genetic, or is it a choice?" If it is genetic, then it would be impossible to overcome – yet, the thousands who have come out of homosexuality and all the stress of it, are testimony that it is a choice… just like alcoholism. One may have a predisposition to it, but they all have a choice to run with it or overcome it, like the rest of us who each have our own areas to overcome. Since the evidence of changed lives weighs in favor of homosexuality being a choice, not a gene, all your arguments about what society says are moot, or else we can all tell drug addicts its alright to keep shooting up and alcoholics there is nothing wrong with drinking, don't feel bad about yourself or your behavior. That would be a lie that binds them to death, much like telling someone they must live out the homosexual lifestyle if they get tempted… which brings up another issue.

        This is spiritual and an unclean spirit can be attached by unwanted sexual advances of a homosexual  who molests. Out of this comes confusion and great stress. The molested needs to know how to be set free to be who GOD created them to be. Your argument does not allow for any of this…

        • sunnstorms says:

          It’s difficult answering such long posts without missing something, but I’ll try 🙂 If I do miss something, it isn’t because I’m “ducking” , I honestly missed it…so ask again what you would like me to answer if I miss anything, ok? 🙂

          You said “So, the sexually transmitted diseases, including HIV among a host of others, are painless? Homosexuality doesn’t cause pain when it brings upon a person massive confusion? They KNOW they are made specifically for the opposite sex – because that is the only way mankind can regenerate.”

          HIV isn’t a “gay disease”, any more than syphilis, gonorrhea, chlamydia, or any other STD is. It just happened to be brought over to the US by a gay airline Steward, so it stands to reason that it would spread first in the gay community. It would be a “straight disease” if it had been a heterosexual who had brought it over.
          They “know” nothing of the sort. They feel it is completely natural to be attracted to someone of the same gender. Considering that God apparently thought it good to mix genders within one body (intersex people), then the only logical conclusion is that God created everyones bodies just as He wanted. One out of 100 are born with varying degrees of male/female chemistry/genitalia….contributing factors to homosexuality.Procreation isn’t the only reason God created people. If it were, there would be no barren women, and no sterile men. Actually, it says in the bible …Luke 23:29 For, behold, the days are coming, in the which they shall say, Blessed are the barren, and the wombs that never bare, and the paps which never gave suck.
          So God never intended for everyone to have kids. God told Adam and Eve to be fruitful and multiply so the earth would be populated…but we are far past any need to populate, given that the earth is overpopulated.

          Introducing alcohol into the body isn’t the same as God creating a body with mixed genders.

          In Romans…., consider who he was talking to and about…idol worshippers and former idol worshippers. He was talking about those who would use sex as a form of worship in the temples. Lust is not Love. “Women changing the natural use”…is talking about prostitutes, not lesbians. “And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge” again is talking about those who turned from God to worship false gods.

          You keep likening alcoholics and drug addicts to homosexuality. They aren’t the same at all. Science proves the existance of mixed gender people…it IS biological, not a self-induced addiction. Even the people in biblical times recognized intersex people…they called them eunuchs (some were born that way, …)

          There is no study that shows anyone can be cured of homosexuality. many claim to be cured, but it’s just to appease family, friends, church, society,….many who claimed to be “cured” committed suicide, went back to the gay life, or choose to pretent to be straight, while in fact are still filled with the same attractins and longings as they were before. You can ride a bull, but it won’t make him a horse.

          Drinking is not a sin…drinking to excess is. Jesus was accused of being a winebibber, and it wasn’t cause He was drinking coffee!

          Hmmmm…I’m not sure why you would speak about unwanted advances of a molester…are you also trying to equate someone who selfishly hurts another with someone who is in a loving, consentual adult relationship?

          Anyone…gay or straight, who molests anyone else is WRONG!! They are acting out of selfishness (and maybe hatred), rather than out of a genuine love and caring for the wellbeing of the other.

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